Zombie processes in list [ACCEPTED-STARTED]

Pr0fessor · August 12, 2013, 04:49:43 PM

Hi.....

if i start a program when PL is running, often no icon is shown and if the process is set as game or multimedia, the rule-column shows nothing (not the "g")
but if i restart PL, everything is fine - all icons are visible and all columns are visible (the "g" for example)

is this a bug or a feature?

; PL 6.6.0.78 / Windows 8 Pro x64

edkiefer · August 12, 2013, 05:41:11 PM

Is this repeatable or does it happen only when system is running long time .

Sometimes icon don't show but I haven't seen the rule issue not showing .

Tested here on few app with 6.6.0.78 beta and seems fine so far .

I am on Win7 Pro 64bit

BenYeeHua · August 12, 2013, 05:47:45 PM

I don't has this issue here, better let the dev to look on it.

And yes, this is a bug, if this is not cause by the system language.

Pr0fessor · August 13, 2013, 03:39:14 AM

hmm - its always the same on tqit.exe (no icon and no rules comumn "g")

and ... thunderbird was visible after PC restart and now its invisible after wake-up from hybernate (and thunderbird restart).

BenYeeHua · August 13, 2013, 05:59:26 AM

So it only happen after you hibernate?

Pr0fessor · August 13, 2013, 07:35:38 AM

not me - the pc

its only happen after hybernate (or hybrid-start (windows 8 standard)) but it always happen on tqit.exe (TitanQuest)

BenYeeHua · August 13, 2013, 05:29:43 PM

lol, I just forgot the "it"(after you hibernate "it")

----
So, did TitanQuest using any anti-hack software/driver?

---

Quotehybrid-start (windows 8 standard)

En...
I also has using this one, but I don't facing it.
Did you try disable "showing the processes icon" and see did it "fixed"?

Pr0fessor · August 13, 2013, 06:00:37 PM

QuoteSo, did TitanQuest using any anti-hack software/driver?

hmmm - i did not see any anti-hack thing-process.

QuoteDid you try disable "showing the processes icon" and see did it "fixed"?

if i disable and enable the function, the icon is visible - and after that if i restart thunderbird (or start other *.exe), the icon is disappeared

BenYeeHua · August 14, 2013, 04:13:29 AM

So let us waiting for the dev to take a look on it, after he finish his jobs and check the forum.

Jeremy Collake · August 14, 2013, 07:54:16 AM

Thanks for the report. It would appear to be a bug. I am evaluating it and will update this thread soon.

edkiefer · August 14, 2013, 08:27:30 AM

I run into this today with Palemonn.exe and IAstorIcon.exe (Intel app, Rapid storage Tech app) .
What happens is you lose info for icon , App name , Publisher, Description and filename columns .

So after see this, I set palemoon to a game/multimedia rule , and while it is listed as one and log says it is now you won't get rule to show either in rule column . also interesting if you try an sort the rules so all X rules are top or bottom the Palemoon doesn't sort right .

Seems random to me only thing done today is windows update (11 fixes) , not sure if that had anything to do with it .

Restarting Palemoon fixes it .
I meant to check Process explorer to see if same thing shows there since it show icon and detailed info that taskmanager doesn't .

Edit: check on the IAstorIcon in process explorer and it show up fine but this is after the fact so not sure it is valid .

Oh and I did windows update before running PL so it can not be that .

BenYeeHua · August 14, 2013, 11:53:40 AM

Windows update is pushed ~~before~~ after(I need to sleep better..) the Op open this post, so it will not be the update.
As I am a bit busy for a few days, sorry for not testing it.

edkiefer · August 14, 2013, 02:01:42 PM

I wasn't trying to say , todays window update was problem but just what could be different . I didn't run anything except Palemoon browser ..

I'll have to try an monitor when it happens .

The main thing though is AFAIK see it is still working ok according to log events so its just a visual thing .

BenYeeHua · August 14, 2013, 05:17:59 PM

Ya, UI is one of the harder one to maintain.

Jeremy Collake · August 15, 2013, 04:40:11 AM

Yes, it is entirely cosmetic - though still must be fixed.

I'll release a beta soon - probably Saturday if not before - that fixes this annoyance and continues the slow advancement of the product

BenYeeHua · August 15, 2013, 05:51:55 AM

User might kill the wrong process if they are killing a closed process, and that process still showing in the list.
For example.
I has facing this bug many times, and luckily everytime I will fail to kill/close it.(because everytime it let me to kill the audiodg.exe

)

BenYeeHua · August 15, 2013, 05:55:13 AM

Quote from: Official Support on August 15, 2013, 04:40:11 AM
Yes, it is entirely cosmetic - though still must be fixed.

I'll release a beta soon - probably Saturday if not before - that fixes this annoyance and continues the slow advancement of the product

I think this bug also the same?
It will leave some ended processes in the list, and I has facing it for a few month...

https://bitsum.com/forum/index.php/topic,3553.msg13490.html

Jeremy Collake · August 17, 2013, 12:57:45 PM

Yes, that is the same bug I believe.

I will know more when I've fully diagnosed the condition. I could ramble about what's probably happening, but better I investigate, fix, then ramble

BenYeeHua · August 17, 2013, 02:29:47 PM

Yup, as it will affecting most user that using PL as task manager.

Jeremy Collake · August 17, 2013, 04:35:45 PM

I'm uploading a new beta shortly that should fix this. Let me know how it goes

edkiefer · August 17, 2013, 06:45:57 PM

It happened again in first few min of freshly booted system . I started PL after boot and then Palemoon , I must of brought up PL GUI cause I see restraint with Palemoon .
After 15min I notice Palemoon lost icon an other info , like posted before .
I tried to reproduce but couldn't (at least w/o rebooting) .

Will keep an eye on this with new beta .

Jeremy Collake · August 17, 2013, 07:12:33 PM

Ok, thanks. I will continue evaluating here too!

Jeremy Collake · August 18, 2013, 10:38:45 AM

And, above, your report of it happening a few minutes after a freshly booted system. Are you speaking of the newer beta?

edkiefer · August 18, 2013, 11:17:15 AM

No, not this beta, the one before the fix (.79b) .

Jeremy Collake · August 18, 2013, 11:27:50 AM

Thanks! I am testing here too. I appreciate you taking the time to check things, as always

BenYeeHua · August 18, 2013, 12:27:29 PM

Yup, the first beta don't fixed, let me testing for the .83 beta now.
BTW, I found out most "dead" processes are showing at the last row, you can see it with that screenshot that I upload before.

Jeremy Collake · August 18, 2013, 12:50:07 PM

If the last didn't fix it, then the most recent doesn't.

Let me take some time to do a more thorough investigation... I'll report back soon!

edkiefer · August 18, 2013, 01:07:53 PM

I was on .79b and didn't see issue but I don't have way to reproduce so not sure as only on 79 a day .
Just updated to .83b now .

BenYeeHua · August 18, 2013, 06:20:36 PM

I just found out one thing that maybe important.
As you can see in that screenshot I upload before, Pl let me killing a hidden process(only hidden in PL), which is audiodg.exe.
Can it has some issues on the hidden function?

edkiefer · August 19, 2013, 07:31:45 AM

Not sure if related but after fresh boot of system and then starting PL , I notice the process SMSS.exe had no icon for few seconds then a default app icon(looks like a folder) showed up but the app name , publisher and description fields are empty .
Going to restart PL again , yes this is repeatable for smss.exe on my win7 64bit . This is different than original posted cause that was something that had no icon at all and changed over time (was ok at first start ).
This does not cause any issue at all, rules work and show up, this is just a visual icon and info lost thing . so its even lesser a issue than OP or my post at beginning of thread .

Jeremy Collake · August 19, 2013, 12:40:36 PM

Thanks guys.

smss.exe and some other system processes are special cases.

If you notice smss.exe's filename, it's \SystemRoot\System32\smss.exe . I will go ahead and add the code to properly resolve them so that the version info (app name, desc, etc..) and icon can be retrieved from the on disk module, but that's the reason for its blank fields.

Also, I'm evaluating BenYeeHua's report of the UI having the wrong process selected for an operation. I'll let you know on that.

edkiefer · August 19, 2013, 01:16:31 PM

Yup , I figured it might be just something with system process , I kind of remember similar thing with another system process it had /$xxxx something . I think you fixed that one with more proper path .

So far I have not seen OP issue .

BenYeeHua · August 19, 2013, 04:57:52 PM

Yup, the dead processes are still showing, but at least they don't showing the priority, so we can know they are the dead processes.

edkiefer · August 19, 2013, 05:16:29 PM

Quote from: BenYeeHua on August 19, 2013, 04:57:52 PM
Yup, the dead processes are still showing, but at least they don't showing the priority, so we can know they are the dead processes.

So those last 4 processes were closed but still show in list ?
I can't reproduce this here on Win7 , how are you closing them ?

BenYeeHua · August 20, 2013, 07:48:03 AM

Quote from: edkiefer on August 19, 2013, 05:16:29 PM
So those last 4 processes were closed but still show in list ?
I can't reproduce this here on Win7 , how are you closing them ?

lol

Explorer is closed when I closed the Windows File Explorer.
TXPlatform is closed itself when I closed QQ.
SearchProtocalHost is closed by windows, after it has done it's jobs.
Firefox is closed by clicking the X.

All of them are closing without killing, if this is what's your means.

If you don't facing on win 7, then it might be only happen with win 8, which will become harder to track on it...

edkiefer · August 20, 2013, 08:50:22 AM

Yes, Just meant if you were forcing them closed (using PL or taskmanager) .

BTW Explorer stays running in Win7 even if you close all folders .

So yes must be win8 thing or specific config thing , either HW or software based (my guess its OS based ).

Jeremy Collake · August 20, 2013, 11:48:03 AM

Quote from: BenYeeHua on August 19, 2013, 04:57:52 PM
Yup, the dead processes are still showing, but at least they don't showing the priority, so we can know they are the dead processes.

Alright, thanks. I will make sure it's fixed in the next build, I'm working on it now.

BenYeeHua · August 20, 2013, 11:49:18 AM

QuoteBTW Explorer stays running in Win7 even if you close all folders .

Nope, this is another Explorer, as I enable "Launch folder windows in separate process".
And, did you know, we can restart Explorer.exe by open Windows Task Manager, and right click on it, click on Restart.(I think this is start from windows 8 )

Quote from: Official Support on August 20, 2013, 11:48:03 AM
Alright, thanks. I will make sure it's fixed in the next build, I'm working on it now.

OK, so did it happen with all version of windows?

edkiefer · August 20, 2013, 12:51:59 PM

Quote from: BenYeeHua on August 20, 2013, 11:49:18 AM
Nope, this is another Explorer, as I enable "Launch folder windows in separate process".
And, did you know, we can restart Explorer.exe by open Windows Task Manager, and right click on it, click on Restart.(I think this is start from windows 8 ) ;)OK, so did it happen with all version of windows?

Ok, didn't know you had explorer setup for separate process .
There no option for restart explorer in win7 , but I had closed/started to do certain tasks , like clean up tray notification list .

BenYeeHua · August 20, 2013, 04:07:01 PM

So it is new feature/shortcut to restart the explorer, and sometimes I restart the wrong one.(should be the desktop process, but I always restart the File Explorer process)

And separate process also not bad, as if the desktop explorer is crashed, you can still having your folder open.

edkiefer · August 20, 2013, 04:32:49 PM

Yes, if you have any issues with explorer crashing that will help .

knock on wood this system running Win7 have been very stable, not one system crash , only app type (which also rare if everything is ok (no beta, alpha, high OC etc)) .

Jeremy Collake · August 20, 2013, 06:01:37 PM

Yes, it probably happens in all editions of Windows.

Does anyone have clear steps to reproduce this? I can obviously force these orphans off the list, but I am more concerned about fully analyzing this.

BenYeeHua · August 21, 2013, 04:11:46 AM

Quote from: edkiefer on August 20, 2013, 04:32:49 PM
Yes, if you have any issues with explorer crashing that will help .

knock on wood this system running Win7 have been very stable, not one system crash , only app type (which also rare if everything is ok (no beta, alpha, high OC etc)) .

Yup, but it only crash like 1 per month.

Quote from: Official Support on August 20, 2013, 06:01:37 PM
Yes, it probably happens in all editions of Windows.

Does anyone have clear steps to reproduce this? I can obviously force these orphans off the list, but I am more concerned about fully analyzing this.

Nope, as you can see, I just closing it normal, and it don't happen now.
---
Ya, can it be IME causing it?

BenYeeHua · August 30, 2013, 11:47:59 AM

The dead process still there, but at least it don't showing at the end of the list.
Can IME causing it?
As it is part of the process from IME.(which I think it is the setting window and other function)

Jeremy Collake · August 30, 2013, 12:57:35 PM

I'm sorry, I've still got this queued - along with the items in the other thread. I will take care of most of it one day, and have more details to share!

BenYeeHua · August 30, 2013, 04:51:09 PM

Not a problem for me, as that process will never being killed.

BenYeeHua · January 03, 2014, 05:04:25 PM

Just want to ask about the progress for this issues.
It look like after I get to running the windows 8 for 10 days(by using the fast startup/hibernate), this issues come out more easier, and still, I saw 1 of the zombie processes is the IME one.
Did anything I can do like the 'protected process'(which using the DebugView and collect the dump/info) to check what's going on?(before I forced to restart the computer)