User Account Control

[parkd1]

Remember when I asked you about rundll32 and it was not showing up? It has something to do with the User Account Control. When I turn it all the way off everything seems to be shown. When It is turned on I have to run it as administrator. I am running Windows 7. Not sure if this happens in Vista. Hope you can come up with a fix for this. Thanks for a ll the help.

[Jeremy Collake]

This topic cleared out by me, to start fresh for users who may have an interest.. Also, it removes some of my more stupid remarks ;p.

First, ensure you really NEED Process Lasso to manage ALL processes, including those of other users. Only single user systems and advanced users should need this. However, sometimes an elevated process is the problem, and therefore requires an elevated Process Lasso to deal with it.

For those of you unaware of how to ELEVATE Process Lasso to HIGHEST Rights

Select 'Options / General Process Lasso settings / Reconfigure the way Process Lasso starts'. On the second dialog, select 'HIGHEST' rights. Now ALL processes will be shown to you.

For users wanting Process Lasso to start at login with Highest Rights WITHOUT a UAC elevation prompt and WITHOUT Windows Defender blocking it

This is indeed possible, and I am implementing it in version 4. The solution was known long ago, but I was too busy to consider it and off in my own little world I guess. Thanks to users here drilling it into my head, I have finally given it some thought and taken their recommendation. From here on out Process Lasso will utilize the Task Scheduler instead of registry keys to start itself. This will allow it to start at login with highest rights, with no UAC elevation prompt -- for those who desire such a configuration.

This will be implemented in version 4. The code is a little more elaborate than a 5 minute chore, but isn't that difficult, so it should not take soon. It is very high on my priority list, so should show up in one of the next alpha builds.

For users wanting to manually set up Process Lasso to start at user login with HIGHEST rights, follow the steps here: http://www.bitsum.com/docs/pl/faq.htm#no_UAC . It takes less than a minute to set up a new task in the Windows Task Scheduler 2.0.

Please remember, when changing Process Lasso to run with elevated rights, be sure to also change its internal configuration -- else it may ignore processes from other users (perhaps desired in some cases, so it gets your elevated processes but not those of others). This can be quickly toggled in the menu option 'Main / Manage processes of ALL users'.

[Jeremy Collake]

Code done.. or at least done enough to work. Great new capabilities ... No UAC prompts again at login for Process Lasso ever again. Whohoo!

The first build with this capability to add/remove itself from the Vista+ Task Scheduler (2.0) will be v3.99.2 alpha. I'll hopefully be uploading that within hours.

[Jeremy Collake]

Below is a screenshot of v3.99.2's (now released) automatic creation of tasks for Process Lasso. At present, it only defers to this method when you choose 'Highest' rights. Otherwise, it defers to the standard method. After all, I must maintain backwards compatibility. I've already incidentally broken W2K compatibility in a separate issue ;o (only in this new alpha, and to be fixed soon).

[mjdl]

The core engine is set as a per-logon task; presumably there should be only one engine running with highest privileges, controlling all processes, so does the engine handle correctly the situation when the user switches to another concurrent user logon ("switch user"), and another instance of the engine starts?

[Jeremy Collake]

I went through the install, and updated the screenshot of the tasks for a more ideal startup config... Well, back to work here.

[Jeremy Collake]

The 'Manage processes of other users option' is also INDEPENDENT of the startup type. So, you could have elevated instances of the core engine running for every user simultaneously, and each ignoring the processes of other users. Anyway, getting all this polished is next.. and fixing a critical problem seen in Vista. Lots of work to do, as I mention in the blog.. still very early alpha.

The installer supports EITHER config though..

[mjdl]

Thanks for the explanation--I'm not actually using betas of Lasso, I just want to keep up with the proposed changes and enhancements.

[Jeremy Collake]

I appreciate you doing so.. it keeps me on my toes. Honestly, I woke up (after about 5 hours sleep), and immediately read the forum. I then got a little too eager to respond to your query, and changed the screenshot too quick. I am always worried I make a mistake, you know. Anyway, for now, know these things:

• We're still in early alpha, and I was just happy to finally have the Task Scheduler code done
• In the coming hours/days I am going to be polishing the release
• I've planned a massive overhaul of the startup config dialogs, supporting the new capabilities
• When I finally get to beta, if there is any condition I've overlooked, or anything you wonder if I've handled.. please do give me a ping, and we'll make sure I didn't overlook it

I should not have release v3.99.2 alpha quite yet, as honesty the core engine crashes with Vista x32 (but NOT Windows 7 x32, strangely). I am fixing it now, and working as hard as I can. I have A LOT of expectations on me, but i plan to make Process Lasso v4 THE definitive version. Of course, I can't do everything in one day, so the progress will be incremental, with each build will be better than the last.

Sometimes I get so eager I release things too early. I still haven't decided if being eager like this is a flaw or not. I mean, there is nothing wrong with being excited, and if I waited until I had EVERYTHING done, then we'd be waiting much longer .

[mjdl]

Well, I've always been flipping between as state of bemusement and respect as I observe your total commitment to product development & quality--amply demonstrated in the results--but also occasionally of concern, since sometimes we can all be driven too much by the pressure of what we imagine others are expecting of us! But we all have our particular foibles...

[Jeremy Collake]

LOL, your assessment of myself is in line with my own assessment of myself. The fact is that I am only human, and do make my share of mistakes. As best I can figure, any success I've had (or will have) will come down to my sheer will-power to overcome my mistakes and work as hard as possible. What really gets to me sometimes is just how much it takes just to live in this ever-so complicated world. I mean, one could be bogged down with minute chores indefinitely.

As for pressure, yes, I do have a breaking point... Let us hope we never find it, lol. I am having a really hard time keeping up with my own relative success with Process Lasso. Sometimes I forget who I've said what to, etc... It is all overwhelming, that's for sure. Then there is also PECompact...

[Jeremy Collake]

I fixed the issue with the crashing governor in v3.99.2 alpha. What terrible timing. I should have never let that build go. It was a linker config setting. Apparently setting '0' on the stack size no longer means it will use the default value, it means it will actually try to do without a stack. Strange, and different behavior than VS2008. Apparently differently OSes handle this setting differently too, with XP and Windows 7 doing better than Vista. I don't know, I don't have all the facts on this one, all I know is that was the singular cause (afaik, and as far as my testing revealed). I knew something was strange when the crash wouldn't occur when the process was loaded in a debugger on the same machine, lol.

Is this transition to VS2010 worth it? I hope so.. that single complication is annoying, but maybe it is the last. I do know I apparently need a faster CPU, as the VS2010 GUI is dog slow on this AMD 9150e (1.8ghz). It is a quad core processor, but low-end so no single thread can do much very fast. I think I may have to swap out for a more powerful CPU when I am able to afford one.

[Jeremy Collake]

During testing I've seen that starting Process Lasso via the Task Scheduler also allows it to start earlier in the login procedure. This means it can help maintain responsiveness while other processes are starting up, similar to a startup delayer but with a different approach (of course).

[Hotrod]

Awesome!! This was something I had asked for early on in the development. This kills 2 birds with one stone so to speak. Keep it up Jeremy. 

[Jeremy Collake]

Awesome!! This was something I had asked for early on in the development. This kills 2 birds with one stone so to speak. Keep it up Jeremy. 

Yes, thanks for continually poking me - finally I took the leap . I should have done it LONG ago. Once I went to do it, it was actually quite easy. Much more work remains on the whole startup config area, but this is a big improvement. I mean, no more UAC prompts .. So many people will appreciate that.

I am that much more eager to get the new final out, but it is a long ways off.. and I should not rush it. Also, once people get proper instruction, they can manually configure the task in the interim. It will introduce them to the revamped Task Scheduler in Vista and Windows 7. I just haven't had the time to make any sort of demo, nor will I. Surely a good one exists on the web somewhere, hmm.. will have to look.

[Hotrod]

If we patch this manually with a Task Scheduler entry now, will it leave a redundant entry there when we update to the new version and it writes it's own Scheduler entry?

[Jeremy Collake]

If we patch this manually with a Task Scheduler entry now, will it leave a redundant entry there when we update to the new version and it writes it's own Scheduler entry?

Good question. By the final, NO, it will not. I've already written the code to match tasks not based on their name, but also based on their target executable pathnames. This means it can find old instances of itself and remove them. Unfortunately, that bit of code isn't functioning in the last alpha.. So, at present you would get duplicated entries unless you happened to name the task(s) the same as what Process Lasso does. Like I said, by the final (or more likely by the time I reach beta), it will remove any duplicate tasks though.